• Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar

Corpus Christi Watershed

Pope Saint Paul VI (3 April 1969): “Although the text of the Roman Gradual—at least that which concerns the singing—has not been changed, the Entrance antiphons and Communions antiphons have been revised for Masses without singing.”

  • Donate
  • Our Team
    • Our Editorial Policy
    • Who We Are
    • How To Contact Us
    • Sainte Marie Bulletin Articles
    • Jeff’s Mom Joins Fundraiser
  • Pew Resources
    • Brébeuf Catholic Hymnal
    • Jogues Illuminated Missal
    • Repository • “Spanish Music”
    • KYRIALE • Saint Antoine Daniel
    • Campion Missal, 3rd Edition
  • MUSICAL WEBSITES
    • René Goupil Gregorian Chant
    • Noël Chabanel Psalms
    • Nova Organi Harmonia (2,279 pages)
    • Roman Missal, 3rd Edition
    • Catechism of Gregorian Rhythm
    • Father Enemond Massé Manuscripts
    • Lalemant Polyphonic
    • Feasts Website
  • Miscellaneous
    • Site Map
    • Secrets of the Conscientious Choirmaster
    • “Wedding March” for lazy organists
    • Emporium Kevin Allen
    • Saint Jean de Lalande Library
    • Sacred Music Symposium 2023
    • The Eight Gregorian Modes
    • Gradual by Pothier’s Protégé
    • Seven (7) Considerations
Views from the Choir Loft

Is the ‘Orans’ Position Disobedient? • Re: the Congregation’s Posture during the Lord’s Prayer

Jeff Ostrowski · October 19, 2024

HE OFFERTORY ANTIPHON for tomorrow—which is the 29th Sunday in Ordinary Time—comes from Psalm 118: Levábo manus meas ad mandáta tua, quae diléxi. Translated into English, that means: “I will lift up my hands towards your commandments which I love.” Increasingly, I’ve observed people attempting to scold Catholics who raise their hands (a.k.a. use the ‘orans’ position) during the OUR FATHER at Mass. We can assume the scolders have good intentions, but I feel such rebukes are inappropriate. Please allow me to explain why I feel this way.

Their Basic Argument • When it comes to people who make memes like this and like this, the basic argument they put forward is twofold. First of all, they point out that no rubric commands this. Therefore, since no rubric commands it (according to their argument), doing it is wrong and must be condemned. Secondly, they point out the rubrics sometimes call for the CELEBRANT to assume the ‘orans’ position. Therefore (according to their argument), people who use the ‘orans’ position during the OUR FATHER are guilty of priesthood simulation (i.e. “pretending to be a priest”).

Sordid History • There were no ‘rubrics’ for the faithful for hundreds of years. Indeed, attempting to micromanage the congregation has a rather sordid history. It began in the 1940s with the LITURGICAL COMMENTATOR, who stood at the pulpit and talked (“ran his mouth”) all throughout the Mass. Monsignor Robert A. Skeris explained such things—in his inimitable way—to Mother Angelica during a legendary 1998 ETWN appearance:


Here’s the direct URL link.

Beautiful Gesture • The ‘orans’ position is how the early Christians prayed. According to Father Peter Gee, it indicates “surrender” to God’s holy will. If someone points a gun at you, what do you do? You raise your hands. During the OUR FATHER, we’re supposed to pray: May Thy will be done. In other words, we’re supposed to surrender to God’s will.1

The ‘Correct’ Answer • Some Catholics are highly educated; others are not. Some Catholics possess a lengthy attention span; others do not. Some Catholics are disabled; others are not. Some Catholics are responsible for taking care of small children during Mass; others are not. The ‘traditional’ way allows each Catholic to pray at Mass as he wishes. It’s really nobody else’s business! While it’s true that no rubric tells the congregation to use the ‘orans’ position, it’s also true that no rubric tells the congregation to breathe air. Nor is there any rubric forbidding it.

Conclusion • It’s difficult for me to see how members of the congregation using the ‘orans’ position during Mass is harmful. The strongest argument against it—in my humble opinion—would be: it’s not really our tradition. On the other hand, I’m not sure anyone really cares what I think about this matter. Do you agree with my position, or do you disagree? I’d welcome your thoughts.

1 Unfortunately, many people say “Thy will be done” but actually mean “may my own will be done.”

Opinions by blog authors do not necessarily represent the views of Corpus Christi Watershed.

Filed Under: Articles Tagged With: Father Peter Gee FSSP, Monsignor Robert Alex Skeris, Not a gesture for the laity, ORANS POSITION during Our Father Last Updated: October 20, 2024

Subscribe

It greatly helps us if you subscribe to our mailing list!

* indicates required

About Jeff Ostrowski

Jeff Ostrowski holds his B.M. in Music Theory from the University of Kansas (2004). He resides with his wife and children in Michigan. —(Read full biography).

Primary Sidebar

Corpus Christi Watershed

President’s Corner

    “Simplified” Keyboard Accompaniment (PDF)
    I’d much rather hear an organist play a simplified version correctly than listen to wrong notes. I invite you to download this simplified organ accompaniment for hymn #729 in the Father Brébeuf Hymnal. The hymn is “O Jesus Christ, Remember.” I’m toying with the idea of creating a whole bunch of these, to help amateur organists. The last one I uploaded was downloaded more than 1,900 times in a matter of hours—so there seems to be interest in such a project. For the record, this famous text by Oratorian priest, Father Edward Caswall (d. 1878) is often married to AURELIA, as it is in the Brébeuf Hymnal.
    —Jeff Ostrowski
    ‘Bogey’ of the Half-Educated: Paraphrase
    Father Adrian Porter, using the cracher dans la soupe example, did a praiseworthy job explaining the difference between ‘dynamic’ and ‘formal’ translation. This is something Monsignor Ronald Knox explained time and again—yet even now certain parties feign ignorance. I suppose there will always be people who pretend the only ‘valid’ translation of Mitigásti omnem iram tuam; avertísti ab ira indignatiónis tuæ… would be “You mitigated all ire of you; you have averted from your indignation’s ire.” Those who would defend such a translation suffer from an unfortunate malady. One of my professors called it “cognate on the brain.”
    —Jeff Ostrowski
    Father Cuthbert Lattey • “The Hebrew MSS”
    Father Cuthbert Lattey (d. 1954) wrote: “In a large number of cases the ancient Christian versions and some other ancient sources seem to have been based upon a better Hebrew text than that adopted by the rabbis for official use and alone suffered to survive. Sometimes, too, the cognate languages suggest a suitable meaning for which there is little or no support in the comparatively small amount of ancient Hebrew that has survived. The evidence of the metre is also at times so clear as of itself to furnish a strong argument; often it is confirmed by some other considerations. […] The Jewish copyists and their directors, however, seem to have lost the tradition of the metre at an early date, and the meticulous care of the rabbis in preserving their own official and traditional text (the ‘massoretic’ text) came too late, when the mischief had already been done.” • Msgr. Knox adds: “It seems the safest principle to follow the Latin—after all, St. Jerome will sometimes have had a better text than the Massoretes—except on the rare occasions when there is no sense to be extracted from the Vulgate at all.”
    —Jeff Ostrowski

Quick Thoughts

    “Reminder” — Month of November (2025)
    On a daily basis, I speak to people who don’t realize we publish a free newsletter (although they’ve followed our blog for years). We have no endowment, no major donors, no savings, and refuse to run annoying ads. As a result, our mailing list is crucial to our survival. Signing up couldn’t be easier: simply scroll to the bottom of any blog article and enter your email address.
    —Jeff Ostrowski
    Gospel Options for 2 November (“All Souls”)
    We’ve been told some bishops are suppressing the TLM because of “unity.” But is unity truly found in the MISSALE RECENS? For instance, on All Souls (2 November), any of these Gospel readings may be chosen, for any reason (or for no reason at all). The same is true of the Propria Missæ and other readings—there are countless options in the ORDINARY FORM. In other words, no matter which OF parish you attend on 2 November, you’ll almost certainly hear different propers and readings, to say nothing of different ‘styles’ of music. Where is the “unity” in all this? Indeed, the Second Vatican Council solemnly declared: “Even in the liturgy, the Church has no wish to impose a rigid uniformity in matters which do not implicate the faith or the good of the whole community.”
    —Corpus Christi Watershed
    “Our Father” • Musical Setting?
    Looking through a Roman Catholic Hymnal published in 1859 by Father Guido Maria Dreves (d. 1909), I stumbled upon this very beautiful tune (PDF file). I feel it would be absolutely perfect to set the “Our Father” in German to music. Thoughts?
    —Jeff Ostrowski

Random Quote

“For me, religious music ceased with the sixteenth century. The fresh, childlike souls of that time alone expressed their vehement, untainted fervor in music free from worldliness. Since then we have had pious musical improvisations more or less made for show. That wonderful man Johann Sebastian Bach only escaped because of his natural genius. He built harmonic edifices as a devout architect and not as an apostle.”

— Claude Debussy (1862-1918)

Recent Posts

  • “Simplified” Keyboard Accompaniment (PDF)
  • ‘Bogey’ of the Half-Educated: Paraphrase
  • Father Cuthbert Lattey • “The Hebrew MSS”
  • Re: The People’s Mass Book (1974)
  • They did a terrible thing

Subscribe

Subscribe

* indicates required

Copyright © 2025 Corpus Christi Watershed · Isaac Jogues on Genesis Framework · WordPress · Log in

Corpus Christi Watershed is a 501(c)3 public charity dedicated to exploring and embodying as our calling the relationship of religion, culture, and the arts. This non-profit organization employs the creative media in service of theology, the Church, and Christian culture for the enrichment and enjoyment of the public.